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Re^2: Basic Literacy for P6 Advocates

by Corion (Pope)
on Aug 05, 2013 at 07:50 UTC ( #1047875=note: print w/ replies, xml ) Need Help??


in reply to Re: Basic Literacy for P6 Advocates
in thread A $dayjob Perl 6 program that runs 40x faster on the JVM than on Parrot

The so-called Perl6 documentation is a very sore point. Recently my boss tried to look at Perl 6, but all of the human-readable documentation he could find as an outsider assumed that he was already fluent in Perl 5. This is quite bad, as it prevents people who do not know Perl 5 from ever learning Perl 6, unless they take the detour through Perl 5.

I don't know what to make of the linked http://doc.perl6.org/ - it feels to me like some automatically generated documentation that is not intended for human consumption. Maybe it is a good reference if you're looking for a concise description of how an operator works, but it surely can't be intended as the starting point for getting in touch with Perl 6.


Comment on Re^2: Basic Literacy for P6 Advocates
Re^3: Basic Literacy for P6 Advocates
by raiph (Hermit) on Aug 05, 2013 at 22:36 UTC
    a very sore point ... my boss tried to look at Perl 6 ... documentation ... assumed that he was already fluent in Perl 5

    Ouch.

    P6 isn't ready for general consumption, and documentation is one of many reasons for that. That said, I don't think p6doc (doc.perl6.org) assumes knowledge of P5 (beyond its existence).

    http://doc.perl6.org/ - it feels to me like some automatically generated documentation that is not intended for human consumption. Maybe it is a good reference if you're looking for a concise description of how an operator works

    p6doc is intended to be the P6 equivalent of P5's perldoc. "I want p6doc and doc.perl6.org to become the No. 1 resource to consult when you want to know something about a Perl 6 type or routine (be it method, sub or operator)." -- Moritz, in the readme of the p6doc project.

    doc.perl6.org is ugly and less usable than it could be because no one has contributed a nice design. Given how simple and cleanly structured p6doc is, it should be relatively easy for a designer who knows CSS and JS to dress it up nicely. Know anyone?

    it surely can't be intended as the starting point for getting in touch with Perl 6.

    Right.

    Imo the smart starting point is to join the IRC channel #perl6 on freenode, introduce yourself, and ask for pointers. If you can't or won't join #perl6, see my P6-documentation-for-contributors PerlMonks post for some alternate starting points.

      who said anything about CSS and UGLY? lol

      I don't think that joining irc, introducing himself and asking for pointers is what my boss is interested in. He's looking for a language to implement and not for a community to join. I have not looked into the documentation, but unless there is enough documentation that does not rely on Perl 5 knowledge, I think you will find it very hard because you basically exclude most of your audience:

      • People who don't know Perl 5 - the documentation is useless to them unless they learn Perl 5 first
      • People who know Perl 5 - while these people could use the documentation, Perl 6 has burned lots of goodwill and interest in the last 12 years

      You seem to be trying to work on the second audience, people who already know Perl 5, and I don't know the efforts to address people who don't already know Perl 5, but at least my second-hand perception is that there is simply no attempt to explain Perl 6 stand-alone.

        Perl 6 is not ready for general consumption. It's not ready for your boss. There's been little incentive to produce documentation for him because the rest of the product isn't ready for him.

        The main audience I'm trying to reach is potential contributors. P6 is a friendly project. Larry hangs out there. You can hack the compiler with nothing but Perl skills. As TheDamian says, it's an extraordinary language. Morale is high and excitement is building. It ought to be attractive to some monks, notwithstanding a decade of disappointment.

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