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Re: Perl 6 ... dead?

by adrianh (Chancellor)
on Sep 02, 2004 at 09:29 UTC ( #387847=note: print w/ replies, xml ) Need Help??


in reply to Perl 6 ... dead?

Well right now there are not that many alternative languages regarding flexibily

How about Python, Ruby, Groovy, Scheme, Lisp, Smalltalk, etc. :-)

Whats your opinion regarding perl and parrot?

I think Perl 6 will be finished. There are enough talented people with the enthusiasm to see it through. Parrot is nearly at the level to implement everything, and the language design seems to be pretty much as far as it can get without having an implementation to play with.

Whether it'll be a success or not I don't know. These things are so hard to predict and depend on many things that have nothing to do with the technical merits of the language.

Personally, I think that the thing that will determine Perl's success is how well Parrot succeeds. It's coming in late to the battle between the JVM and the CLR and, to a lesser extent, the various Smalltalk/Lisp VMs. With implementations like Jython and IronPython proving that you can implement dynamic languages reasonably on the JVM/CLR that's going to be a tough fight to win - whatever the technical merits.


Comment on Re: Perl 6 ... dead?
Re^2: Perl 6 ... dead?
by perlfan (Curate) on Sep 03, 2004 at 14:26 UTC
    It's coming in late to the battle between the JVM and the CLR and, to a lesser extent, the various Smalltalk/Lisp VMs. With implementations like Jython and IronPython proving that you can implement dynamic languages reasonably on the JVM/CLR that's going to be a tough fight to win - whatever the technical merits.

    You forget its financial and platform availability merits - it is free, and should run *anywhere* Perl5 runs - which is any platform that can run C.

    BTW, the list is asking for volunteers all the time. Infact, there were 2 calls for help today, and They are always looking for testers.
      You forget its financial and platform availability merits - it is free

      I can get a JVM and a CLR for free (as in beer). I don't see cost as an issue.

      and should run *anywhere* Perl5 runs - which is any platform that can run C

      Which is, of course, cool.

      Unfortunately having many platforms only helps in the commercial world if they are platforms that the commercial world is interested in. The JVM runs on platforms that Perl doesn't run on that just happen to be platforms that commercial folk find attractive.

      Take mobile phones for example. Nokia will be shipping over 400 million mobile devices with the JVM on this year. Convincing everybody that they should support Parrot too will, I think, be tricky.

      BTW, the list is asking for volunteers all the time. Infact, there were 2 calls for help today, and They are always looking for testers

      Some tuits! Some tuits! My kingdom for some tuits! :-)

      I have the greatest respect for the Parrot and Perl 6 developers. Perl 6 is an interesting language. Parrot is going to be a really great technical platform (I'm really looking forward to implementing Prolog on Parrot when the Spare Time Fairy next visits :-)

      However, I've seen other interesting languages and great technical platforms fail to get broad acceptance. I just hope Perl 6/Parrot won't join them.

        Take mobile phones for example. Nokia will be shipping over 400 million mobile devices with the JVM on this year. Convincing everybody that they should support Parrot too will, I think, be tricky.
        That depends. Jarkko might do it for the hack value; AFAICT that's why there's Perl on the 6600.

      Unfortunately, time, willingness and enthusiasm are not enough. Not only must you have these, and C skills, a hi-speed link that doesn't bill you by the minute, you must have a complete understanding of:

      1. CVS
      2. rsynch
      3. diff
      4. patch
      5. Configure
      6. (g)make
      7. yacc
      8. lexx
      9. gcc extensions to standard C.

      Basically, being a fully paid-up unix system programmer is the base criteria.

      And that's before you start trying to understand pir, pasm and pick your way through a directory structure that is twice the size it could be because it contains everything including a gob load of stuff that is completly irrelevant to the basic parrot code. Compilers for half a dozen, half completely irrelevant languages amongst other stuff.

      And woe betide you if you mention that your trying to build parrot on a Win32 system.


      Examine what is said, not who speaks.
      "Efficiency is intelligent laziness." -David Dunham
      "Think for yourself!" - Abigail
      "Memory, processor, disk in that order on the hardware side. Algorithm, algorithm, algorithm on the code side." - tachyon

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