Re: (OT) my first fired experience

[JavaFan]

in reply to (OT) my first fired experience

I don't know whether it's normal. It certainly hasn't happened to me, and I have parted ways with employers many times. One thing I've learned: it doesn't pay to have any company loyalty after being laid off. Always file for unemployment - and be honest with the employment office. Do not feel sorry for your supervisor; he couldn't protect you, so why risk your benefits (which you seem to desperately need) for his sake? Don't worry about the reference. People are too afraid to give bad references, specially if they are unfounded, as they may get sued. Get a reference from a co-worker. Or explain in an interview how you parted with your previous employer, and that that is why you didn't ask them for a reference.

It may be too late now, but it isn't too late for your next job: join a union. I did, after parting ways in a bad way with an employer (who suddenly claimed it had no money to pay its employees), and it did pay off when parting ways with another, if only for the free use of their legal department (the parting of ways was done cleanly, via a court settlement (that way, my unemployment rights were protected). I phoned my union once, got a form to fill out, did not even have to appear in court myself, got half a year of severance pay. Legal fees: nada. This was in Europe, BTW)

[leocharre]

A union.. haha.. this is the U.S.- other countries send soldiers to your home, take you out in the middle of the night and shoot you. We- well, we send you bills.

All kidding aside, there are some stringent requirements for unionizing in the U.S.- I know if you work for the city of DC, for example, you can opt into one- I also know that in Boston- it's illegal to unionize if you're not fulltime- (something of that sort is the loophole).

Love the things I hear of Europe. Seems like you guys don't spend most of your budget on things to kill people- that's inspiring- almost as if you guys learned something from wwii about the importance of treating the average person with care and respect.

Phew..

You make a sensible point about what to take personal and what not to- about filing for unemployment quickly. And yes- the advice about not holding loyalty- especially in such a situation- after an ending relationship- real world.

moritz also makes a point about not being overly concerned with references. I think it's sound.

Yes, it's not personal. That's something I taste here- I think it's financial. It just seems so dirty. Why not just say something more honest- aha- I think that- if they said something like "we're having trouble with clients etc, we may be laying you off in the next x timeframe"- that would put them at a disadvantage. Because then they have someone who may at any point tell them they found other work- etc. Or maybe they fear having now someone working with less interest/etc.

I'm still concerned with their angle- what kind of dispute they will offer up- and having my wits about me to say the right things when I talk to the people managing unemployment disputes.

There's a paper trail all over, in my favor- it's just so petty to take things to that level.-

I'm quite - sobered- about what I see stated in these responses- that people are hessitant to - esentially- tell the truth- about their former employees- I guess it's obvious- but I for one- had no idea that a reference from a previous employer was such an empty piece of paper!

[Anonymous Monk]

Love the things I hear of Europe. Seems like you guys don't spend most of your budget on things to kill people- that's inspiring- almost as if you guys learned something from wwii about the importance of treating the average person with care and respect.

The US took the de-facto policing role after Europe's industries were laid to waste or otherwise prohibited from war-making after the World Wars (obviously not as strenously as Japan, who got a constitution that does the same). Not to mention that staying less aggressive helped to avoid provoking the Soviet Union, which occupyed a significant portion of the continent. For good or ill, Western Europe outsourced almost all of its military as a matter of immediate necessity and, shortly after, Cold War politics.

I can't speak to the change in culture in the intervening century or so, though the soviet political model seems to not be completely out of favor in influencial parts of their Union.