Re^3: Perl 6: Managing breakages across Rakudo versions

I'm all for Rakudo improving the experience of deploying and maintaining serious code, but it's disingenuous to hand-wave away any differences between "some people are doing this with it and they don't mind babysitting their code between releases" and "you should take this seriously because it's ready for deployment like any other mature piece of software you might expect".

I've been burned before. Rhetorical flourishes and linguistic contortions to redefine away objections won't convince me that I can ship a project built in Rakudo to paying customers (without losing money on support) because people have good intentions now, or Larry wrote a message somewhere.

When the Rakudo developers meet the commitments they've made and demonstrate that they can continue to meet those commitments, I'll take ~~them~~those commitments seriously.

Edit to add: I mean that last paragraph sincerely. I believe everyone involved is acting in good faith. All I mean is that I'm not going to be an early adopter.

Comment on Re^3: Perl 6: Managing breakages across Rakudo versions

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Re^4: Perl 6: Managing breakages across Rakudo versions by raiph (Deacon) on Jul 17, 2012 at 20:36 UTC
it's disingenuous to hand-wave away any differences between "some people are doing this with it and they don't mind babysitting their code between releases" and "you should take this seriously because it's and ready for deployment like any other mature piece of software you might expect". I agree there's a big difference between the two levels you describe. It's so big there's room for at least one more stage in between, which is what I believe is Rakudo Star's niche. When the Rakudo developers meet the commitments they've made and demonstrate that they can continue to meet those commitments, I'll take them seriously. As you know, I still take them seriously, as you once did. I believe Patrick's request for comments about such commitments, and concrete steps designed to meet them, are appropriate, sincere, serious and have already been productive.	[reply]
Re^5: Perl 6: Managing breakages across Rakudo versions by Anonymous Monk on Jul 18, 2012 at 08:56 UTC
...I believe Patrick's request for comments about such commitments, and concrete steps designed to meet them, are appropriate, sincere, serious and have already been productive. You've got to be kidding me and all of us. A question was posted on stability policy for Rakudo. So then a question was asked if Rakudo is mature enough for a backwards compatible release which warrants a support/stability policy What follows next is Perl 6 developers announcing there is no such thing like a backwards compatible release going to happen any sooner but they need a stability policy regardless. Ask why they would need one when there is no release that could even use it and answers go around arguing strange semantics of stability and support The fact is you know it pretty well, you don't have a release with you for which you can promise any kind of stability whatsoever. You also know that the monthly releases and star releases of rakudo are basically 'works on my machine' trunk snapshot of the code repo zipped and uploaded. The purpose of a monthly release is to have a stack of work finished and well supported without breakages to previous releases. With documentation and libraries shipped. Its not a ritual you need to execute in front of a deity every month. You are not in need of a stability/support policy currently as you don't need it. You don't have a release that you can apply it to.	[reply]
Re^6: Perl 6: Managing breakages across Rakudo versions by raiph (Deacon) on Aug 02, 2012 at 21:40 UTC
You are not in need of a stability/support policy currently as you don't need it. You don't have a release that you can apply it to. Whether or not there is a current need for a policy, or a release to apply it to, Patrick has listened to feedback and applied the results to the latest Rakudo Star release as I explain below.	[reply]