Re^3: Perl 6 is going to get a lot faster in 2013
by DrHyde (Prior) on Feb 04, 2013 at 11:46 UTC
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Larry can declare that speed is the number one blocker of adoption as much as he likes. The real blocker to adoption is that perl 6 ain't yet complete. | [reply] |
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The real blocker to adoption is that perl 6 ain't yet complete.
What makes you think so? Do you have any data that supports your statement?
I ask because when we released the first version of the Rakudo Star distribution, we got loads of feedback. And most of it was along the lines of "the features are very nice, but it's too slow". Which indicates the the majority of potential users doesn't think that he lack of completeness is the main problem.
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Yes, I'm looking forward to trying it out. I've never used it.
I agree that perl has always been somewhat incomplete, in the sense that it's always possible to make it better. But that's a silly way of interpreting completeness. I've given an example (which took me approximately 30 seconds to find using google) elsewhere in this thread of a core feature that doesn't yet exist. I understand that object introspection and macros are also still not implemented.
If I didn't already have a set of excellent tools available, then I might consider using perl 6 even in its current state - just like I did back with early perl 5.
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Re^3: Perl 6 is going to get a lot faster in 2013
by chromatic (Archbishop) on Feb 03, 2013 at 21:46 UTC
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For example, Larry Wall declaring speed to be the #1 blocker of adoption in November.
A lot of people have declared a lot of things over the lifetime of the project. Most of them haven't happened. I will believe them when I see them.
... if NQP gets faster, Rakudo Perl 6 gets faster.
That's nonsense. Features aren't free. Parrot has at various times beaten a lot of languages and implementations on various microbenchmarks, and Rakudo and even NQP didn't.
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Fwiw I posted this meditation and these responses mostly for those who might enjoy:
- core hacking that's vastly simpler and more likely to be accepted than Perl 5 core hacking
- using Perl 6 when it's a lot faster
(This may well not include chromatic.)
For example, Larry Wall declaring speed to be the #1 blocker of adoption in November.
A lot of people have declared a lot of things over the lifetime of the project. Most of them haven't happened. I will believe them when I see them.
Larry Wall isn't just a random person and he wasn't declaring that anything has happened. He's the leader of the Perl 6 project, he focused attention, and #perl6 folk listened. (Another example: Moritz forgot to mention he added sink (void) processing in late December, something that had been on the todo list for many years and which makes most code in void context a lot faster.)
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Parrot has at various times beaten a lot of languages and implementations on various microbenchmarks
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that has been the case for a long time (ie since the removal of the JIT in 2009(?)), and never for any language except PIR.
Rakudo/JVM might or might not work out, but as far as I can tell we already know that Rakudo/Parrot has not.
-- gerdr
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As I recall, these were microbenchmarks without the JIT in 2010 and 2011. I don't have that code anymore, so I'm going by memory. They were definitely hand-written PIR code, though.
If what I recall is true, then you can draw two conclusions. First, performance on a microbenchmark represents little more than performance on a microbenchmark. Second, features aren't free.
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