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If Class::Std or "some of the others" interfere with some other tool, why do you blame Class::Std and some of the others, and not the other tool?

Have you looked at how Class::Std is implemented? It's pretty crazy. It includes some "worst practices" too, like use of the UNIVERSAL:: namespace.

"inside-out objects" as a name doesn't suggest anything about being standard

The name is Class::Std, i.e. "Class Standard."

we'd still be using the indirect object notation, because that's how we used to teach programmers in the literature. Views change over time, and documentation isn't static.

If Class::Std ever became a very common way to do things, to the point where the Perl man pages used it in their OO examples, I would drop this objection. I think the difference between Class::Std and normal OO perl is a lot bigger than these other examples you gave though.

we'd still be using the indirect object notation, because that's how we used to teach programmers in the literature. Views change over time, and documentation isn't static.

You're misunderstanding me. What I'm saying is that any attempt to enforce encapsulation is ultimately futile when the other person has the source and can simply change your code to expose things that they want. I will grant that it's much harder to do than it is with simple hash-based objects though.

UPDATE: Class::Std does not actually put things in UNIVERSAL::. This technique is suggested in the inside-out objects section of the PBP book, but not used in Class::Std.

In reply to Re^3: Seeking inside-out object implementations by perrin
in thread Seeking inside-out object implementations by xdg

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    [ambrus]: 1nickt: the tea didn't have sugar or honey or lemon or milk. or even caffeine in a significant quantity. it's really "colored water", warm water with some fruit smell to make it more pleasant than ordinary warm water.
    [ambrus]: 1nickt: in theory, it shouldn't hurt the electronics, but also could temporarily cause problems until it dries, and the inside of the keyboard doesn't dry quickly, because it's closed.
    [ambrus]: 1nickt: that's the theory. the theory is also that it should have dried by Sunday morning, but it didn't. so I dunno.
    [ambrus]: I'll try today evening if it works now.

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