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Tiobe index - Perl is having a hard time

by reisinge (Hermit)
on May 01, 2018 at 18:47 UTC ( [id://1213902]=perlnews: print w/replies, xml ) Need Help??

"But what about Perl? Till 2005 it was the most dominating scripting language in the world. In 2008 we said in an interview with Dr. Dobb's Journal that Perl would go extinct based on the trend we saw in the TIOBE index at that time. After this a religious war started with Perl diehards who claimed that this won't happen and that the TIOBE index was being gamed. Stevan Little gave a ground-breaking talk in 2013 called "Perl is not dead, it is a dead end" indicating that once software engineers leave the Perl language they will never come back. Personally I think that the fork of Perl 6 (and its delays for decades) together with the unclear future of what was going to happen to the language was the main reason for engineers to look for alternatives such as Python and Ruby. And still today the Perl community hasn't defined a clear future, and as a consequence, it is slowly fading away." -- TIOBE Index for April 2018 (retrieved on 2018-05-01)

There is a difference between knowing the path and walking the path. -- Morpheus
  • Comment on Tiobe index - Perl is having a hard time

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Re: Tiobe index - Perl is having a hard time
by choroba (Cardinal) on May 01, 2018 at 18:54 UTC
    Yes, ten years ago they forecast Perl would be extinct, and 10 years later, it's still there. What a wonderful foresight!

    ($q=q:Sq=~/;[c](.)(.)/;chr(-||-|5+lengthSq)`"S|oS2"`map{chr |+ord }map{substrSq`S_+|`|}3E|-|`7**2-3:)=~y+S|`+$1,++print+eval$q,q,a,
      The propaganda is indeed the most damaging part.

      IMHO a marketing consultant would suggest to rebrand the product now.

      On another note: Nobody seems to remember how people used to talk about JavaScript 15 years ago. ..

      Cheers Rolf
      (addicted to the Perl Programming Language and ☆☆☆☆ :)
      Wikisyntax for the Monastery

Re: Tiobe index - Perl is having a hard time
by Your Mother (Archbishop) on May 01, 2018 at 19:21 UTC

    Whoo-hoo-hoo, look who knows so much. It just so happens that your programming language here is only mostly dead. There's a big difference between mostly dead and all dead. Mostly dead is slightly alive.

    :P FWIW, I've done a couple of greenfield projects professionally in Perl in the last 10 years and many personal projects. I'm paid at the top range of the market for senior devs. I just looked up the highest salary ranges by language and Perl wasn't even included in their top 10. Then I read the article to see the numbers and I make above every range listed. There was a Perl medical startup that was eating the lunch of a lot of gigantic companies in this time period too because the old companies are deeply vested in generally terrible and aged WIN-oriented tech and platforms in an industry that is being shaken pretty hard on multiple fronts.

    Plenty of nice languages today. Perl is still one of them whether or not tech managers have been led to believe otherwise. Adopting Perl as your main language is a fairly savvy move too because as I alluded there is a lot of Perl out there and not a lot of expert Perl devs. In the given supply and demand, it's a sellers' market. Caveat being, the jobs aren't everywhere so one might need to be willing to move for a Perl job.

Re: Tiobe index - Perl is having a hard time
by RonW (Parson) on May 01, 2018 at 21:34 UTC
    And still today the Perl community hasn't defined a clear future

    I'm not sure what he means by this. My best guess is a perceived lack of a series of "5 year plans" stating what changes are planned, for which releases and when those releases are scheduled.

    Perl is maintained (mostly?) by unpaid volunteers. Maybe Python, Ruby, etc - whatever is touted as being "the future that Perl won't have" - have corporate backing that Perl doesn't have. Or, maybe the people maintaining them are more like the (highly paid) "MS Project Jockies" that manage projects for big corporations. I don't know.

    I think what's most damaging to Perl is commentary like what the OP quoted. Unfortunately, I don't know how to counter it.

    Update: Radical idea: Drop the "5" and call the next major release "Perl 28.0". (except, Larry won't allow that)

        "I think what's most damaging to Perl is commentary like what the OP quoted. Unfortunately, I don't know how to counter it."
      I think one solution is to continuously hack the planet with excellent must-have software written in Perl! It doesn't even have to be complicated. As the ultimate glue language Perl has an infinite number of potentialities.

      For example Perl is installed by default on OSX and Linux. Both of these operating systems have around 2000 command line programs. Few Mac users know what lurks beneath the desktop. Perl can expose this power by wrapping and combining system commands and canning complex syntax to invent new commands that make hard things easy.

      Fortunately packaging Perl programs for cross-platform distribution has never been easier!


Re: Tiobe index - Perl is having a hard time
by stevieb (Canon) on May 02, 2018 at 13:44 UTC

    Considering a friend and I just successfully completed a fundraiser for a new Perl book, I would personally like to say that dude is full of shit, and it's just FUD.

        Is it just me, or is dropping the OP in a Perl forum seem a bit like Troll Bait?

        As to the topic;
        This is really more a matter of who's in Vogue in any given year. If not being in Vogue means you're dead. Than I guess there are (already) a lot of "dead" languages.
        Topics, and Blurbs like this so frequently seem to surround some self serving market hype.

        λɐp ʇɑəɹ⅁ ɐ əʌɐɥ puɐ ʻꜱdləɥ ꜱᴉɥʇ ədoH

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